3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Moderator: SEOP Mods

User avatar
boogerred
JV Backup
Posts: 1335
Joined: October 19th, 2006, 7:39 am
Location: Main Event at the WSOP

3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by boogerred » May 27th, 2008, 7:47 am

Well, it's time once again for this debate. So here we are.

Do you think power cleans are good for football players? and why or why not?



User avatar
jiveturkey
Bench
Posts: 218
Joined: March 17th, 2008, 3:45 pm
Location: Near a river (Like everyone else on this site)!

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by jiveturkey » May 27th, 2008, 11:30 am

football players need to bench press to get stronger in the upperbody and do squats for their legs to get faster.

cleaning is for olympic pretty boys and janitors

User avatar
Boonedawg
JV Starter
Posts: 1688
Joined: March 19th, 2006, 5:18 pm
Location: “It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong.” ~Voltaire

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by Boonedawg » May 27th, 2008, 12:54 pm

Heck yes they are! I'd rather be hit by a dude who benches 400 than a dude that cleans 300. :122249

User avatar
mtswngrvsg
JV Starter
Posts: 1677
Joined: November 11th, 2004, 1:43 pm
Location: On the Banks of Lake Symmes

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by mtswngrvsg » May 27th, 2008, 2:14 pm

Once again it depends on who you talk to. At one time I would have argued that you had to do Power Cleans but now not so much. After watching several kids get hurt doing them you start to change you tone. Was once said that if a kid could power clean 250 they would be an allstate football players. Well guess what, seen players do over 250 and they simply were not very good football players. It is about the total package. So did I have my kids power clean-yes. Would I do it again-no. Results vs risk! There is no exercise that you can do in the weightroom that will simulate playing the game!

User avatar
The Riepo Man
Freshman Starter
Posts: 731
Joined: February 28th, 2008, 4:51 pm
Location: GET UP, COME ON GET DOWN WITH THE SICKNESS!

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by The Riepo Man » May 27th, 2008, 8:45 pm

Power cleans work both upper and lower body muscles and builds coordination at the same time so who wouldnt like those? Youre basically dead lifting it then shrugging the bar while jerking it upwards and then squating the weight to finish...its an all-around great workout

User avatar
tigercannon71
Purple Hippo
Posts: 28490
Joined: November 16th, 2004, 6:14 pm
Location: Waiting on my ice cream bars!

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by tigercannon71 » May 27th, 2008, 11:37 pm

Power cleans are a great exercise for football. It gives you that explosive ness that you need for coming off the line. Your legs, hips, arms, and hands gotta work as one to get the weight up quickly. That being said you need to do them in good form and as part of a workout program that includes bench, squats, and deads.

OVCfan32
Bench
Posts: 206
Joined: November 12th, 2004, 1:05 am
Location: Chesapeake, home of the panthers
Contact:

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by OVCfan32 » May 27th, 2008, 11:55 pm

If you had to do one single lift. . . . .it would be the clean. .
use low weight for safety. . . .do the full clean and you work chest and legs.. .
Its the only lift you really really really really should do. . . .
bad foot, bad knee, tweeked back . . . . out of the question

RICKYVAUGHN

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by RICKYVAUGHN » May 28th, 2008, 7:44 am

How can getting a stronger, more explosive back, arms, chest, legs, etc be bad thing? My college coach used to say a better athlete is a better athlete. Period.

User avatar
boogerred
JV Backup
Posts: 1335
Joined: October 19th, 2006, 7:39 am
Location: Main Event at the WSOP

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by boogerred » May 28th, 2008, 10:26 am

I would most definitely have them as one of the core lifts in a weightlifting program unless I had a Hammer Strength Jammer.

User avatar
The Riepo Man
Freshman Starter
Posts: 731
Joined: February 28th, 2008, 4:51 pm
Location: GET UP, COME ON GET DOWN WITH THE SICKNESS!

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by The Riepo Man » May 28th, 2008, 10:33 am

I know wheelersburg has them as a core lift along with bench, squats and incline

User avatar
KarlAgathon
JV Backup
Posts: 1008
Joined: February 27th, 2008, 11:07 am
Location: "The only people that ever stopped the option was ESPN." -- Tony DeMeo

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by KarlAgathon » May 28th, 2008, 11:36 am

Ricky Vaughn's answer comes pretty close to my takeon this issue.

I do believe that using the power clean as a training tool will help make make athletes stronger, and probably have a positive outcome on speed and explosiveness.

By extension, I would say cleans are good for FB because improving strength, explosiveness, and speed would seem to be good attributes to improve for football players.

I don't think that cleans are that risky, though. It is kind of curious to hear football coaches -- who are teaching kids to run into each other at full speed -- express concerns about the safety of performing an a lift involving a barbell that starts on the floor.

User avatar
boogerred
JV Backup
Posts: 1335
Joined: October 19th, 2006, 7:39 am
Location: Main Event at the WSOP

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by boogerred » May 28th, 2008, 11:52 am

People talk about cleans being dangerous, but I have only ever seen one injury from power cleaning. Mtswngrvsg probably witnessed the same injury that I am talking about.

User avatar
jiveturkey
Bench
Posts: 218
Joined: March 17th, 2008, 3:45 pm
Location: Near a river (Like everyone else on this site)!

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by jiveturkey » May 28th, 2008, 1:13 pm

I would think only an idiot wouldnt want his players learning to clean.

User avatar
tigercannon71
Purple Hippo
Posts: 28490
Joined: November 16th, 2004, 6:14 pm
Location: Waiting on my ice cream bars!

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by tigercannon71 » May 28th, 2008, 1:14 pm

Any exercies is dangerous without the proper form. Thats why players in the weight room should be highly supervised and stopped and corrected if they are using incorrect form.

User avatar
mtswngrvsg
JV Starter
Posts: 1677
Joined: November 11th, 2004, 1:43 pm
Location: On the Banks of Lake Symmes

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by mtswngrvsg » May 28th, 2008, 1:37 pm

Some food for thought, do with it what you want.

What's wrong with the power clean?
Coach and Athletic Director, Feb, 1999 by Dan Riley, Jason Arapoff


Twenty-five years ago, the weight-lifters - the only tutors of the era - "sold" the power clean to our track and football coaches as a means of developing explosiveness. A generation has passed and many strength programs continue to incorporate some form of the clean.

It is a demanding and complicated exercise. We admire the technique and proficiency demonstrated by skilled lifters. However, the inherent dangers unique to this movement can make it a potential hazard.

In the starting position the athlete goes from almost no load on the body to sudden impact. It places the muscles, lower back, tendons, and joints, in a vulnerable position. Throwing a heavy weight into the air and catching it is a difficult task.

Who is Dan Riley?

http://www.houstontexans.com/team/coach.asp?coach_id=5

User avatar
boogerred
JV Backup
Posts: 1335
Joined: October 19th, 2006, 7:39 am
Location: Main Event at the WSOP

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by boogerred » May 28th, 2008, 1:42 pm

But I am sure there are others who are in favor of it.

User avatar
KarlAgathon
JV Backup
Posts: 1008
Joined: February 27th, 2008, 11:07 am
Location: "The only people that ever stopped the option was ESPN." -- Tony DeMeo

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by KarlAgathon » May 28th, 2008, 1:52 pm

Now we have some debate going on !!!

From the Riley article:

It is a demanding and complicated exercise. We admire the technique and proficiency demonstrated by skilled lifters. However, the inherent dangers unique to this movement can make it a potential hazard.


Substitute the word "Jumper" or "tackler" for "lifter" in that quote, and it is still a true statement. Yet we still have basketball, high jump, and the great sport of football.

I have read some of Riley's stuff before. However, we still run crossing patterns over the middle of the field, despite the fate of Darryl Floyd Stingley.

"Every enterprise has a certain particle of risk" -- Allardyce T. Merriwhether

User avatar
boogerred
JV Backup
Posts: 1335
Joined: October 19th, 2006, 7:39 am
Location: Main Event at the WSOP

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by boogerred » May 28th, 2008, 2:06 pm

Driving a car is potentially dangerous but we do that also.
Last edited by boogerred on May 28th, 2008, 2:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
KarlAgathon
JV Backup
Posts: 1008
Joined: February 27th, 2008, 11:07 am
Location: "The only people that ever stopped the option was ESPN." -- Tony DeMeo

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by KarlAgathon » May 28th, 2008, 2:07 pm

We let TEENAGERS drive cars...

User avatar
mtswngrvsg
JV Starter
Posts: 1677
Joined: November 11th, 2004, 1:43 pm
Location: On the Banks of Lake Symmes

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by mtswngrvsg » May 28th, 2008, 2:07 pm

You want to argue just to argue, that is fine! Oh well, here is the whole article.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... _n18608442

User avatar
KarlAgathon
JV Backup
Posts: 1008
Joined: February 27th, 2008, 11:07 am
Location: "The only people that ever stopped the option was ESPN." -- Tony DeMeo

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by KarlAgathon » May 28th, 2008, 2:10 pm

I believe that the thread is named

3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Of course, maybe they are biased, but try this link:

http://www.biggerfasterstronger.com/upl ... search.pdf

or this

http://www.biggerfasterstronger.com/upl ... Cleans.pdf

User avatar
mtswngrvsg
JV Starter
Posts: 1677
Joined: November 11th, 2004, 1:43 pm
Location: On the Banks of Lake Symmes

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by mtswngrvsg » May 28th, 2008, 2:44 pm

Hit a nerve? 8)

I have been on both sides of this issue over the years. Watched kids do the power clean, some very good some not so good. Have seen kids be out of the weightroom over the years because of the power clean. Looking back just have to wonder if the risk was worth the results? Like I said earlier, have seen good power cleaners that were not very good football players and have seen kids that were not good in the weight room that were very good football players. The main purpose is to make the young men better football players and to give them the tools to play the game as safe as possible. Will every coach agree on how to do things?-NO. So you run into the samething with this. Is one way better than the other, each will say their way is the best. The key to coaching is to have an idea of what you want to do, stay with it, and coach it hard. Would I use power cleans again-NO!

User avatar
sandman
Bench
Posts: 212
Joined: August 15th, 2007, 7:41 am
Location: On the banks of the Kyger

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by sandman » May 28th, 2008, 3:13 pm

I do not know much about it other than that it needs to be taught, demonstrated and monitored individually if it is to be done. Athletes today, through improvements and advances in the science of lifting, are handling very heavy weights, often with poor form. This particular exercise is difficult to do correctly and at high weights could lead to some serious back and other injuries.

I agree that it needs to be done, but carefully and under supervision.. If there is a machine substitute, that is what I would like to see because they tend to force form. BTW, squats have the same problems if not performed properly.

OVCfan32
Bench
Posts: 206
Joined: November 12th, 2004, 1:05 am
Location: Chesapeake, home of the panthers
Contact:

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by OVCfan32 » May 28th, 2008, 3:28 pm

plyos are by far the best for improving an athlete in almost every way. . . .but god i'd rather clean and squat than broad jump 50 yards. . . i hate plyos

cleans with low weight. . you can't beat that

User avatar
boogerred
JV Backup
Posts: 1335
Joined: October 19th, 2006, 7:39 am
Location: Main Event at the WSOP

Re: 3rd annual "Are Power Cleans Good for Football" Debate

Post by boogerred » May 28th, 2008, 11:40 pm

GOd Bless the Hammer Strength Jammer!!!

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests