Old fashion football

[ddavis]

John, I just left Bluefield when you came in at Salem. I think 1978 was the last year I played. I graduated in December. I went to The University of Dayton for one semester. That was 1972. I couldn't afford that place. I quit school for a couple of years. I worked at Sunray Stove Company in Delaware, Ohio and then came back to Portsmouth and worked at Dayton Walther Foundry. I couldn't shake that football addiction so I saved some money and wrote some colleges within 200 miles of my home. I ended up at Bluefield but that's another interesting story that I'll save for a while. That offense is really interesting. I would think a quick athletic quarterback would really be important. I've been looking at some things as a changeup to our doublewing. People tend to change personnel to stop us so I'd like something that's completely different that we might do anytime just to mess with them. This is a possibility. We didn't pass much last year but we do have some kids with excellent hands. My wife is waiting for me to help put her new kitchen table together so I have to run.

[RogueWarrior1965]

LOT of Interesting reading here...I love to hear Snuffy talk about his days of coaching too

Snuffy Smith was my first football coach. Another class act and all around great guy. He had/has a great love for the kids as well. We still chat every now and then when I see him at a football game. He was broadcasting the Minford vs. Huntington Ross game (I think) this year and we were talking about getting old. I told him he did not seem as old anymore because I am now the age he would have been when I graduated! I told him in hindsight, he was/is young! He has great stories and I never tire of hearing them.

I know the A11 offense post was not to me, but they looked like a really small team, so maybe that is why they went to it so they could maximize speed and skill. If you have a big team, I not so sure how well it would work.

If you ever want to see the spread offense at its best, look for some film from Kenton High School 4-5 years ago. Ben Mauk was the QB (he is at UC in Cincinnati now) and he set all kinds of rushing and passing records in not only Ohio, but for the country. They played Portsmouth West in the State Finals in 2002 or 2003, so if there is anyone on here from West, you could speak to this much better than me.

[JohnKnight]

I have plenty of DVDs to watch the spread, Waverly has done it pretty well the last two years. I have been at Waverly since 1987 other than the Dewitt years. I have seen a good bit of offense.

[ddavis]

As far as I'm concerned if it has anything to do with football we'll talk about it and anybody join in. RW, you're exactly right about Ben Mauk while at Kenton. I'd be in a spread if I had him. Again, it comes down to personnel. Kenton always has the state powerlifting championships and they have some nice looking athletes. I had the pleasure of knowing Ed Bolin and he loved to flip that ball in the air. Ed was always very generous to me if I needed a film. He had success at Glouster Trimble as well. Ed really brought wide open offense to the SOC in my opinion. My reason for endorsing smash mouth football is to keep offenses like Waverly s' off the field, if possible. If they're hard to stop don't let them have the ball. John, I'll make it a point to meet you sometime. I'm sure you could teach me a few things about the pasiing game and if I don't use it on offense then it will help give me some ideas on new ways to stop it. I have to do something but play on this computer. I'm going to practice on the guitar and then put some trim up. Later.

[RogueWarrior1965]

I have plenty of DVDs to watch the spread, Waverly has done it pretty well the last two years. I have been at Waverly since 1987 other than the Dewitt years. I have seen a good bit of offense.

I am sure you have as Waverly has had an excellent teams the past few years, but I am telling you, I have never seen it ran like Kenton. Some of Mauk's stats at Kenton are: National records with 6,540 passing yards and 76 touchdowns through the air his senior season ... set national career passing records for completions (1,105), attempts (1,931) and yards (17,534) and is second with 179 career passing touchdowns. That's right 6,540 yards passing his senior year, not mentioning what he rushed for. If you never saw it, it was truly a work of art. The kid was amazing. Kudos to his Dad, who was the head coach at Kenton.

[hilltopkid]

[quote="ddavis My last thought. Most everyone knows Coach Smith. A wonderful,wonderful man who there happens to be a lot of funny stories about. Well, I can remember one practice Coach Smith was playing quarterback with the first offense. Remember the center and both guards were very close friends and we all played football, lifted weights and ran track so we were always together. Snuff bent over and put his hands deep under the center and Walburn (the center) farted. Needless to say the whole team rolled. We couldn't stop laughing. Every time Coach tried to get under center one of us would make that dreaded sound and it all started again. Finally, he got fed up with us and sent us to the showers. I'm sure we didn't do that again but that day was the most I ever laughed at a football practice. I've always been careful about getting under center as a coach.[/quote]
A couple of things regarding your post.1sr-it's great to actually see some other coaches on here discussing football. Too many times it's youngsters or just people looking to start things.I have to admit, you are the last one I expected to be discussing things w/ on SEOPS, but it's pretty cool. 2nd-Snuffy Smith is definitely one of my best memories of my entire East experience.What a man! God bless Snuffy!
3rd-Thats why it's handy to have Todd on your staff. He's the perfect scout team QB, and he doesn't even care if they fart on him.lol right TG?
4th-Your story of flatulence and getting under center reminds me of an ex-East coach-Ed Thompson. Has anyone read the new book "And Tress said to Troy..."? In the back there's the story of how Ed supposedly got switched from QB to LB. He was a Fr and running the Scout team. He put his hands up tightly to the centers groin, only to find out the center had something "hanging out". The story explains that Ed, in his "southern Ohio" twang said a few select curse words.I guess that was his last day at QB.lol It is hillarious! good read.
Keep up the good stories.
I have one similar. When I played at West Liberty,I was playing NG and we were at Shepherd. The QB was a top-ranked player in D-2 at the time,Jim Signora. It was a very hot September day. As he approached the center and started calling his cadence, he started puking all over the centers back. The center said"GD it Jim, what the hell ya doin?".Both lines started rolling and the ball got dropped and JIm fell on the ball for a broken play. It was disgusting but very funny

[billcox]

GO WITH THE POLECAT!!!

[ddavis]

Hilltop. I'm naturally a private person. I enjoy being with family. I have been told that people mistake my quietness at times as being stuck up. I'm usually not comfortable around people I don't know. Especially in a crowd. I truly believe this site has done me a great service in the ordeal I'm presently experiencing. Let's just say that I bet my accusers are much more nervous than I am. This is my way of saying thanks. I probably would have never made a post if things hadn't happened. I am enjoying it though.

I never read the article on Ed you're talking about. I think he told me once when Corny (as I think I remember Ed calling him) came his chance of playing quarterback became very slim. Cornelius Greene may have been Ohio States first black quarterback. I'm not sure. If I ever get any of these memories mixed up somebody please correct me. Who in their right mind would want to be a quarterback when they could be a linebacker anyway? It's better to give than receive.

Maybe we could make a trick play using that puking act. The quarterback is in a shotgun. He starts walking towards the sidelines and starts puking. As this is happening the center snaps the ball to a back (and of course since this is coming from me) he runs it.

Your story about Ed reminds me a a prank played on me my senior year in high school. One day as I was putting on my gear getting ready for practice I smelled the most God awfullness smell. It was around my locker somewhere. I looked in my helmet, all through my clothes, the inside corners of my locker, everywhere. I finally went down to practice. Each day it seemed to get worse and I went through the same drill. Finally, after several days I found Limberger (spelling) cheese stuck on the shell side of the top pads in my helmet. My same mile relay buddies were showing me how much they loved me. Don't think the old cramergesic in the jockstrap trick wasn't used to get even.

[hilltopkid]

I know what it's like to be a private person. I'm pretty much a loner when I'm not around my family or friends back home. Just me and the Dog. Although I have found a pretty good gal finally. As we talked about in the past, my reclusiveness, and enjoying living in a one way holler, has been mistaken by some as being too private.Oh well, what can I say.I like a place I can either shoot a gun or relieve myself from my front porch and not get a ticket. lol I actually live in town now and I absolutely hate it.I wont be much longer though.
I've seen a similar version of the trick play you speak of. Now, naturally yours involves running the ball(go figure)lol, but this was a pass.When I was a Jr at WL we were at WVState. State had the ball on their own 45 or so.The coaches started screaming at the QB as if they wanted him to change the play.He held his arms up like he was confused and started walking toward the sideline.The whole staff was screaming.As he was walking to the sideline the center snapped it to the RB and the RB threw the ball to a WR running a fade down the sideline.Luckily, our Safety ran him down just inside the 20.
Atually, my last year at east, we had this play installed with Brent Downing, but I never had the opportunity or ,perhaps, the kahunas to try it.

As far as this forum goes, I enjoy it.Always have.I know a lot of coaches don't believe in it, but Id say the same amount do. Most of them don't reveal their identity, which is fine.Thats their choice and they probably have good reasons.I don't use my real name,like you, but Ive never hid my identity. No need to really. I enjoy talking football. Sometimes it's easy to get caught up in nonsense, but I try not to. I'm glad you decided to give it a try.Heck, we talk more on here than we did my 3 years at East. As far as you being stuck up.You mean your not? just kidding.Actually I just thought you didn't like me for screwing up your program with my ways of doing things. I'm sure it wasn't easy for you at times, and likewise. Thats why it was good to have Todd,JD, Darrell, Jimmy and guys like them that were there w/ you so we could keep alot of the same terminology etc... Trust me, it aint easy fillin your shoes.
Keep up the chalk talk.I'm enjoying it.Maybe some more will get involved, but I think you'll find out that there are only a few guys that really like to get into the "guts" of the game.I'd say most of the posters are generally fans of their team and post accordingly.

[ddavis]

While you were at East I thought of it as your program. Most of that time I had more important things to worry about. My mother going to a nursing home, my brother dying of cancer and then my mother dying. I did feel like a fish out of water though. I didn't know where I belonged. I rarely talked football even to Todd. I'm proud to say that he was loyal to you, though. He never said a negative thing about you to me.

The nice thing about not throwing much is you can remember the ones you do throw. That brings me back to early in the 1991 season. Back then we started the season with three SVC teams. Piketon, Huntington and Paint Valley. We won our first two games and had to go to Paint Valley for the third date. I'll be darn if they didn't run the opening kickoff all the way back. Gary Newsome was there then and they were a very tough team. I new we had to play an excellent game to win and thought oh sh_t when that happened. Guess what? When they kicked off to us Barry McGraw returned that kickoff for a TD Barry was a freshman at that time and a backup to Guy Dempsey and David Bradford in the backfield. Two touchdowns had been scored and the game was just starting. I should have taken that as a sign as to what type of game it was going to be. We battled back and forth that game and they had the lead late in the game with time running out. Not having enough time to run the ball down the field I had to throw. I called a pass and then turned to the player that was going to take the next play in giving him some type of instructions, I guess. All of a sudden I hear a roar and our crowd is going wild. I had to ask someone what happened. The camera man missed the play so I never saw the winning play. Jason Lowery had thrown a long pass to his brother Chris Lowery and Chris took it to the house. I'd like to tell you exactly what happened but to this day I really don't know. Stacy Bond an offensive tackle at the time and an assistant coach now told me he had to calm Chris down before the play. I guess I can understand the nervousness since our quarterbacks main job has usually been to hand off and fake. That team won their first nine games before losing to West in the last regular season game and Wheelersburg in the playoffs. Again, those two games are another story.

[55buckeyes98]

"Old Fashioned Football" or "3 Yards and a cloud of dust" wins football games, but doesn't get the interest of some of the fans who think that what they see on TV is "easy" to do. The colleges and pros that we watch on TV make it look as if an average high school team can run what they run. While there are some smart and educated "fans" they do not know your team or players or your philosophy. I have a power-running philosophy because we believe in controlling the clock and wearing out our opponent because we are strong and in better shape. If we limit mistakes early and keep a team from getting more than 14 ahead we believe we can control the line of scrimmage and finish off our opponent at the end of the game and play great defense. We have been more successful at the school I am at than any other coach since the playoffs began, but continue to hear the naysayers out there. Do what you believe will best help you win ball games. If it's spread or power I, whatever you do, do it well and you will win some games. Only 6 teams in the state can be "champs." We try to measure our success in the quality of young men that graduate from our program and hope that what we teach helps us win the league, make the playoffs, and give us an opportunity to win the region and state titles.

[ddavis]

Let's slit our wrists and become blood brothers.

[biggdowgg]

Let's slit our wrists and become blood brothers.

[hilltopkid]

I'm proud to say that he was loyal to you, though. He never said a negative thing about you to me.

Thats good to hear. Thats why I've kept in touch with him, same with Jimmy.He's doing a tremendous job up here and the kids and staff love him. He's really turned out to be a very good coach.Last year he ran the JV offense and he put the muddle huddle in one game. We're always trying to convince our HC to try it in a game, ut hey think were goofy.This year I'm running special teams and Jimmy's helping me w/ PAt/FG.You can bet that the teams we play better honor it when we get into that formation. Jimmy gets all excited like a giddy school girl when you start talking muddle huddle.He starts drawing up plays and talking all fast.lol

I have heard about the game you mentioned above since Stacey and Guy were on my staff. They mentioned that year a lot and rightly so.We even found some old game films and watched them . RB's like Guy and Bradford are hard to come by, especially when they run behind behemoths like Bond. I got to know a former MArietta coach, who is struggling w/ Cancer right now, Gene Epley. He was a rep for Gillman Gear for awhile.WHen I asked him,He still remembered Guy when he played at MArietta for a year or two before joining the military, and spoke highly of him. I only met a few of them, but watching that old game tape(against VAlley at Allard PArk) you could tell you had some studs. Teams like that are few and far between.
If I'm not mistaken, haven't all three Demspey's been involved with either a league championship or undefeated season? Thats pretty cool and something they should cherish.

[ddavis]

You're right about the Dempseys and SOC chanpionships but I'll let Axe and Shield talk about that if he wants. We ran a full house with those guys. Guy and David were very quick off the ball plus they were willing to block for each other. Our main plays were dive, power, belly power, and counter power. Our passing would have been a power pass, pop pass and a boot pass. These are the plays we ran in that big win against Paint Valley in 1991. Rusty Webb still runs these plays. I like a lead blocker. I'm going to make a confession here. One reason I like to run the ball is I feel much more comfortable calling a running offense over a passing offense. It just feels more natural to me. I was a linebacker and a lot of what I do in calling plays is attacking linebackers. I'll give an example. I'm pretty sure we lost our next two meetings against Paint Valley but in the 1994 season expectations were high for both teams. They came to Allard Park and we came away with a 12 to 0 victory. Here's what we did. Paint Valley had two very quick linebackers who flowed very well. The thing we noticed was that these linebackers didn't attack dives or isos well. They played two defenses, 52 and 62. We had two freshmen that played key roles in this game. One was Todd Gilliland who played quarterback and the other was Andy Messer who played a guard. Andy was very quick off the ball and I think this was his first start. He was told to get off the ball and get a piece of the linebacker on dives and block down on isos. Todds' job was to go up to the line of scrimmage and let the rest of the team know what play we were running. We also lined our backfield up a little different' I think we called it an inverted T or something. We had two halfbacks and instead of a fullback and we had a tailback. This enabled us to run quick dives with the halfbacks and also quick isos. Brian Monroe, Adam Sylvia and Barry McGraw were the backs, I think and Adam may have gone to TE when we went to an "I". In the "I" we ran fullback dives and isos. We controlled the ball, the clock and the game. It was a wonderful game plan and until now most people had no idea what we did. Some people think if your not drawing pick plays and crossing patterns you're not using your brain.

[hilltopkid]

I'm not a big passing guy either, however, I do like the 3-step game and play action. If I had my druthers, and could run my "perfect" offense, Id have to say it would be the offset I. I like having a lead blocker, b/c my favorite play w/o a doubt is the Power. I also like being able to motion the Fullback or H-back as some would call it and offset him to either side of the formation. I also like being able to throw the ball to the backs out of the backfield and especially to the TE. I think in HS, if you have a good TE and do the right things w/ him, you can give DC's fits. I know from coaching defense if we dont get a lick on the TE and allow him to run free we're in trouble(Ohio State vs LSU ring a bell?)

Also, a perfectly executed 3-step game is nice when you have the kids that can do it.Its hard to defend and frustrates the PAss rush guys, especially when you have the OL cut block.

As far as play-action goes,I always like to find what our best run plays are and install a play action pass off of that play.
There's no play like the Power in my book. My first year at East we played Harvest Prep and we were playing pretty good at the start of the season.They couldnt stop Ricky H on the power.We must've run that play 50 times. 36 power . 37 powere. 36 power. Why run anything else if youre getting 6-10 yards a pop?I know the next weeks opponents didnt get much out of that game other than we like the power play.lol
Another great play in HS, is the Mid-line option. We used it a lot that same year, with Enz, untill he got hurt. We would also run a QB keep. similar to the mid-line, but we wouldnt option anyone, and we'd pull the PS guard.
Two years ago, when we(Chillicothe) were playing Jackson and got pounded, they ran the mid-line from the unbalanced to the weak side and we couldnt stop it. They had a good Qb(the Holzapfel(sp?) kid from Wellston) They expect you to shift to the unbalanced which we did, and they run it to the weak side. This year when we played them, we didnt shift to the unbalanced side. We just lined up as is and waited for them to hurt us on the strong side. They tried the midline and we shut it down. We were bound and determined not to get beat by that play again.The funny thing is, I never really saw the midline untill I started coaching down in Southern Ohio. I suppose someone ran it when I played in the MSL, but I never really knew what it was. You don't see it in college, and when I was coaching HS in NC we never saw it.I really like it now.I suppose b/c I'm a D-lineman and I know how difficult it makes it for that DT.

[ddavis]

I think as our area was slow as a whole to develop college type passing games we jumped on the midline pretty quick. It's a pretty simple play to run and it's another way to get an athletic quarterback the ball. It's tough to stop. As far as the college level I would think the academies and schools without the high profile quarterbacks would run it more. I won't argue about the power off tackle. It's been good to us over the years. Many years ago when Merle was still at Symmes Valley the Vikings and East were in a low scoring dogfight. Merle had those defensive ends closing down hard and attacking that blocking back when we ran power. Finally, late in the game during a time out we changed the play to an off tacklle lead play so the end wouldn't crash down and sophomore Barry McGraw popped off a long touchdown run and we won a close game. I guess the powers success depends on the fullback/defensive end matchup. Usually, one beats the other down and takes control. It's always nice when the winner of that battle is on your team!

[Rutterkickballer]

this thread is agreat read