Private schools/Public schools/open enrollment public

[LICKING COUNTY FAN]

That is horrible.

I would have went to them directly showed them their rules in their rule book , if that did not get action I would have suggested my school leaders use their attorneys to fight that.

I do think the OHSAA is as shady as they come, its all about the money for them. Especially the current group.

[Raider6309]

Mooney is trying to move the school so they can recruit better athletes

[wrestlefan1]

One of the guys handing out the stuff was a Dad of a kid that had played with that group of boys in 7th grade. He pulled his son to a feeder school. He was trying to get more of that team to follow his son. That IH team was very very good without reed. They really could have made a run at a title with Reed. I moved out here after that school year.

[wrestlefan1]

A couple of years later, Chris Carter had twin nephews at IH. They were part of the IH program though the first week of 2 a days their freshman year and up and left for Moeller.
One interesting note is that the different Catholic schools have different ways they can take kids. For example, Moeller can only bring in kids that live in the area of their diosees (sp?) where as Elder has no limit to the area they can take kids. Elder can pull from anywhere in the city. I learned this because Reed Hamilton lived in Camp Dennison which was down the hill from Indian Hill. Camp D was not part of the Moeller Diosees. Moeller anexed that area so it was included.

[Raider6309]

I couldn't imagine how many catholic schools tried to get Burrow. I was surpised he stayed in Athens. Athens did lose Ibi to Pick Central

[LICKING COUNTY FAN]

I couldn't imagine how many catholic schools tried to get Burrow. I was surpised he stayed in Athens. Athens did lose Ibi to Pick Central

Central is a public school.

[fortdawg]

How can this be up for argument?
You pick your team from the local block, road, or school district----I get to pick kids from the whole city, the whole area, and multiple school districts. Can you win some? Sure. Will I win most of the time? Absolutely.

Numbers don't lie----compare the total number of public schools to private schools---now look at the teams in the playoffs and the number of championships won.

I'm open to hear an argument explaining the dominance that happens other than recruiting. It's not the pay or anything that I can see. But I'd like to hear the other side.

[billcox]

Most of the people who cry about recruiting/cheating are clueless about how things actually work. There are both public and private schools across the state who enjoy advantages over the schools they compete against. The playing field will never be completely level. There are just to many factors that come into play (population density, socioeconomics, tradition/success, politics/money)..

[wrestlefan1]

I really dont care about recruiting. It happens all the time though. I really believe that if the home coach is making his program the absolute best he can, the effects of recruiting would be very minimal. If you dont do your job and provide the kids the best means possible, it is likely that a high level talent will go somewhere where a coach IS doing everything to provide those means.
The coach that has sat around and not done the things necessary, will sit there and cry because he lost the kid that would have made his team tough-yet he didnt have to do anything.

I say this, although in my 20 years of coaching, I have NEVER had to endure coacing against a kid that was once part of my program.

[Ironman92]

No amount of recruiting,lack of coaching or lack of talent would ever be enough for my kid to transfer schools.

[wobycat]

Most of the people who cry about recruiting/cheating are clueless about how things actually work. There are both public and private schools across the state who enjoy advantages over the schools they compete against. The playing field will never be completely level. There are just to many factors that come into play (population density, socioeconomics, tradition/success, politics/money)..

You really need to get out of the 100 mile radius of southern ohio. Recruiting/cheating happens everywhere, the difference in public and private is public will happily accept the transfer, no matter the athletic ability. They now get state money for that student. Private schools can pick and choose who they let in. The city private schools exploit athletes. Look how many d1 athletes come from those areas compared to ours.

[chiefs]

How can this be up for argument?
You pick your team from the local block, road, or school district----I get to pick kids from the whole city, the whole area, and multiple school districts. Can you win some? Sure. Will I win most of the time? Absolutely.

Numbers don't lie----compare the total number of public schools to private schools---now look at the teams in the playoffs and the number of championships won.

I'm open to hear an argument explaining the dominance that happens other than recruiting. It's not the pay or anything that I can see. But I'd like to hear the other side.

Certainly, but getting kids in the door is easier said than done for schools such as Bishop Rosecrans, Fisher, FCA , and Portsmouth N.D.

Regarding your last point, using the school I support as an example, tradition and pride has played a big role in our successes. Now, post-recession we've struggled in basketball and football but that culminates on one hand to the economics of tuition being especially difficult for a time span roughly stretching 2008-2013. The other hand saw changes in administration and too many coaches and principals that came from outside of the FC community in that period of time that didn't understand or had a personal testament towards our tradition and pride we took in doing everything we could the best we could do. Thus, it serves as no surprise how our enrollment has dropped from 320 in 2006 to 185 in 2014 (I would say the emergence of FCA has played a considerably small hand in this happening also). Despite this, our academic tradition is still strong and attracts kids and their families from outside of Lancaster, which in turn does yield some very-spirited and determined student-competitors on the fields and the courts, but most importantly in the classroom. It builds competition and enables an opportunity for these kids to be a part of something bigger than them while also being a part of them. Competitive success builds confidence - Trimble's football team for instance will graduate several classes of young men that got to be a part of something special with the satisfaction of the fruits of their labor being shown for everyone in SE Ohio to see. It's like that in MAC country and to a certain extent what you see in Rosecrans, ND, FCA and Fisher in their athletic and academic accolades.

Tradition and pride - it's an advantage the successful private and public (open enrollment and closed enrollment) schools enjoy. Racine So's gym has several banners for basketball and baseball where they had to create another banner to be able to list all of the success those programs have seen at the sectional, district, and regional levels. Ironically, if you go to Fisher's gym, there's more banners for state titles and state runner-up finishes its academic (quiz bowl) team in the past ten years than all of boys' athletic state titles and 2nd place finishes they've won since 1900. Those banners aren't getting kids to enroll into FC or Southern Meigs schools, instead it's getting those kids in the schools to put their best foot forward and make it count because they don't want to be remembered as that team that didn't win the league and sectional in baseball or didn't qualify for their OAC state finals tournament (Fisher's case). Tradition carries high expectations and raising the bar, you see this with Wheelersburg, Oak Hill, Bloom-Carroll etc (and just as a fun side note, if you read the banners I mention in FC's gym, all of those kids listed were also lettermen in their respective varsity sports.

Tl;dr - tradition... it's not just a word they sing about in Fiddler on the Roof.

[xxChampionxx 5]

Athens did lose Ibi to Pick Central

That's not possible. There is a giant wall around Pickerington that no outsider has been able to cross. It was necessary to keep out recruiters from the local obscure D5 parochial school offering brochures and t-shirts to young players looking for the prestige of playing for a nationally televised team that has a separate press box just for all the NCAA FCS scouts.

There are different kinds of advantages and disadvantages that transcend the simplistic public/private dichotomy. In the super D1s (GCL-South + Eds + Iggy's), it's a combination of just pure numbers as well as legal dadcruiting. There is no need for the coaches to be involved or even aware. The talent just shows up. In large quantities. I'm in favor of putting them in their own association and tournament like the MIAA that I'm familiar with from Baltimore. A real no-limits all star league would be cool to watch.

Among the second tier D1, the story is largely the same. The country folk are locked out of competition by numbers, distance, and economics. But only slightly. An apartment in Hilliard to play for Brian White probably isn't a high barrier for a family that can afford camps and whatnot. There isn't anything magical in the water in Pickerington that makes football players grow there. They just move in. Permanently or temporarily. Doesn't make a difference to OHSAA.

Who wouldn't want to play for a good coach?

The biggest factor influencing success is hard work. St Charles gets kids from all over central Ohio. Doesn't matter. They don't kill it in the weight room like Burg. And they''ll never succeed until they do. And even if they learn and change, they still won't have any advantage unless all the suburban public football academies shut down. Looking at metro privates like Hartley, TCC, or CCC who have won two titles each in the last 40 years as being the same as the private dynasties listed above plus Mooney, Ursuline, and SVSM is just ignorant. It's just punishing hard work and good coaching. I'm not in favor of that.

[xxChampionxx 5]

Certainly, but getting kids in the door is easier said than done for schools such as Bishop Rosecrans, Fisher, FCA , and Portsmouth N.D.

It's impacting the city schools too. Rising tuition, declining neighborhoods. It adds up to enrollment problems everywhere. Ready will be lucky to last another 10 years.

[xxChampionxx 5]

The city private schools exploit athletes.

This statement is misguided and hateful.

[selonmc]

High school football mirrors life: high school football is not fair, and neither is life... deal with it. There is nothing that can be done about it and nothing that really should be done about it.

The most talent is around the high population areas because that is where the people are. Take Kirtland for example. Mentor is a city of about 50,000 people, and is one of the largest public schools in the state of Ohio. Kirtland is a small town of 6,000 about 4 miles from Mentor's city center. There are only 22 starting positions open on the ultra competitive Mentor High School football team. If you live in Mentor and want to get on the playing field why not go down to Kirtland? Is Kirtland recruiting? They don't have to.

The only thing about catholic schools is they can control their enrollment. Without opinion polls and evidence to back my statements I can only say that it is my opinion that many more kids would like to attend Youngstown Ursuline than is allowed. Their facilities can only hold a certain number of students and they have no interest (or as they may claim the money) to expand. They just happen to save a dozen desks for 4 and 5 star blue chip athletes that can run a 4.5 40; and being in Youngstown area with a population of 80,000+ and a defunct public school system they are there for easy pickings. You can't legislate against that... and you shouldn't. Let the market decide.

You can still get a lot out of high school football without having a plastic first place trophy.

[Orange and Brown]

Why the heck even start this thread??????

[Eagle82]

Anytime a little ole public school from southeast Ohio can stick it to a private school up north, I'm happy.

[pappy1]

I worked in Newark during NC's domination of small school football in Ohio. JD Graham took that program to a pinnacle that few teams reach. The present NC coaches father was a co-worker and friend.
Another friend and co-worker had a grandson that was a very good athlete at Newark Hi. He sustained an injury as a sophomore that cut his football season short. That spring when he tried out for baseball he was cut and told he needed to spend all of his time getting ready for football. That summer he played Legion baseball. He was good enough to make the Legion team, but was cut from the NHS team. He wasn't happy about that and transferred to NC. He was a catholic kid, but I couldn't have blamed him for transferring if he wasn't.
I am guessing there are other transfers for differing reasons. Many years ago I tried to talk my son into transferring to FC but he didn't want to. (we are not catholic) He played on a very poor team going 0-10 his senior year. The MSL was a ten team one division league at that time. He was named 1st team all league QB from that 0-10 team.
Having said all of that I think there was some recruiting going on, still some but not as much today. Open enrollment has leveled the playing field in that respect. I think an advantage that private schools have comes from having parents who put out tuition $$$ and expect more from their children. When I say more, I am not saying there are public school parents who do not have high expectations of their children. However for the overall student body there are higher expectations for a private school Those high expectations carry over from the class room to athletics.
A lot of players who transfer to a good team are hoping to get a scholarship offer from the exposure. I can't blame any kid for trying to up there chance to get a paid college education. There are teams that are good who could move to a whole different level of competition with the addition of the right player. Keeping that in mind, there will probably always be some recruiting at private and public schools.

[The General]

A lot of kids have gotten exposure. But a lot of them have got exposed. Many unrealistic parents have found this out.