Ironton 8th grade

[momcat]

I watched the Verity/Ironton 8th grade game this past Thursday. As impressed as I am with Ironton's team, I have to wonder what the ages of these boys are. I have a very hard time believing that the boys that took the field this week at Putnam Stadium were all legitimate 8th graders or appropriate 8th grade age. This team did not even resemble last year's team. Are there any repeat key players from last year except Dion Brown?

In addition to looking suspiciously older than our boys, the Ironton team played shamefully dirty football. There were countless late hits and cheap shots some that were caught by officials and many more that weren't. This not only reflects badly on the players, but on the coach who allows this behavior and the program as a whole.

If the Ironton representatives have nothing to hide they can post their roster with player # and birthdates.

There is no doubt that Ironton has had a long history of successful football. It's a shame that incidents like this cast a shadow on the legitimacy of a win. In any case, the Verity Patriots battled back in one of the most gutsy performances I've ever seen. I can't think of another team down 26-0 in the last 4 minutes of the game that could pull out 3 touchdowns in a row with two of them being forced turnovers. Our boys are true warriors in every sense of the word and the Ironton players and coaches should adopt some of their class the next time they step on the field.

[queenofhearts]

All the Ironton 8th grade players are the right age. I can tell you this by watching them play biddy leage. Alot has hit growth spurts and are alot bigger now. Some are taller than me now. And i do beleive some of the players are actually 7th graders.

[itownpaw]

These boys are 8th graders. I taught them last year in the 7th grade. Dion played some last year as a 7th grader on the 8th grade ball team and is an actual 8th grader this year.

[sportyfan]

MOMCAT,

I am in complete agreement with you on the Ironton Boys!! Jackson 7th and 8th grade played them and some of their 8th grade boys played down on the 7th grade team. They did call Jackson and ask this but, they said they did not have enough 7th graders to make a team. Irontons roster had 15 7th graders. last I checked takes 11 to make a team. I think the only way the 8th graders should have played in the 7th grade game was if players got hurt and they absolutely needed them.

As far as the 8th grade team goes they are some of them in definite question. One of our parents is an aunt to one the Ironton boys and she saw him after the game getting in his car along with one other boy and asked him what he was doing and he grinned a sheepish grin and said playing football. Mind you he was a 16yr old Freshmen. So they are known to cheat so why havent they been questioned by AD from the schools playing them?? I believe they have the correct roster but I believe that the right kid isnt suited up in the uniform!!!

[ohbuckeye2]

So you all disagree with itownpaw who taught these kids in school that they are 8th graders. Sounds like you need to have your ducks in a row before making accusations that they are not 8th graders and are known to be cheaters.

What's your proof on either statement.

[sportyfan]

Proof??
How about That a lady from Jackson saw her 16 yr old Freshman nephew getting in his car after the game and grinning and telling her he was there playing football. Her husband wouldn't let her go to the AD with this info because how could they prove it after the game and Jackson was home???

As I said I believe the right kid and birthdate is listed on the roster but wrong kid wearing the uniform!!

[ohbuckeye2]

Proof??
How about That a lady from Jackson saw her 16 yr old Freshman nephew getting in his car after the game and grinning and telling her he was there playing football. Her husband wouldn't let her go to the AD with this info because how could they prove it after the game and Jackson was home???

As I said I believe the right kid and birthdate is listed on the roster but wrong kid wearing the uniform!!

I don't believe it, but if you are so sure of yourself go to Irontons AD and do something about it and get those games forfeited, it would be the right thing to do.

[sportyfan]

Actually--It is just water under the bridge now but I can bet it will be watched more closely and questioned in the coming years. I am glad to see other teams thinking the same as Jackson Junior high teams. It is not that we are poor sports either we take our spankings and learn from them. But when you have these things surface such as eligibilty than you tend to get a little upset over a loss.

[BlindWhiteHat]

Proof??
How about That a lady from Jackson saw her 16 yr old Freshman nephew getting in his car after the game and grinning and telling her he was there playing football. Her husband wouldn't let her go to the AD with this info because how could they prove it after the game and Jackson was home???

As I said I believe the right kid and birthdate is listed on the roster but wrong kid wearing the uniform!!

Wow, what a credible source. Someone whose child just lost a game is the star witness against Ironton for playing freshmen in a junior high football game. I don't know which is worse, that someone would accuse a school of doing that or someone who believes that to be true.

Sportyfan, you say it's water under the bridge but you are still whining about a loss that's over a month old. Plus, you should have your password deleted for bringing up such a falsehood.

[Frank Reagan]

Good grief. I think this hits it. The absolute, most ridiculous thread ever on SEOPS.

Congrats momcat for starting it and sportyfan for agreeing with momcat.

[sportsfan43]

so , this kid , who is 16, drove from Ironton to Jackson, had another boy witrh him, to play a junior high football game?

not sure about Ironton, but where I come from, the junior high kids HAS to ride the bus with their coaches

[gotigers]

All of the accusations are a complete lie! I challenge anyone to turn Ironton in and be investigated and you will find an official answer to your accusations. Do you really think Ironton has to cheat to beat Jackson and Ashland in a game?

Also, I have been to all the Freshmen games this season which are often at the same time as the junior high games and don't notice any of their players missing. BTW.. they are undefeated too! They played Gallia Academy at home at the same time Ironton and Ashland were playing their junior high game. So, besides cheating, they also must be magic to be in two places at once.

GO TIGERS!!!

[squints]

I do not believe that the original post accused anyone of anything; it simply brought up some legitimate suspicions and observations. I do believe that a few of the subsequent posts were laced with illogical and emotional jabs that are not very credible. However, one should not ignore the facts and some of the issues of the original post that are yet to be addressed.
· Fact #1- Ironton did play 8th graders against Ashland’s 7th graders. I would consider this cheating. In answer to the question, “Do you really think Ironton has to cheat to beat Jackson and Ashland in a game?” I would say, “No” because it was attempted and failed as Ashland won the game anyway.
· Fact #2- Some of the personnel for Ironton in the 8th grade game differed from their personnel in last year’s 7th grade game. That is not to say that there is an impropriety, but could explain some of the suspicions of the Ashland parents.
· Fact #3- Ironton’s team was much bigger and much more mature looking than the boys on Ashland’s team. In last year’s game, there was not as great of a size discrepancy. Once again, this proves nothing but could explain some of the suspicions that these boys were not of the same age level.
· Fact #4- Due to the fact that Ironton played 8th graders in the 7th grade game (see Fact #1), it is completely plausible that 9th graders could have been used in the 8th grade game.
· Fact #5-Ashland has a rule that if an 8th grade player is age 15 by the start of school, he must play up to 9th grade and is not allowed to participate in 8th grade football. All of Ashland’s players are 14 or under. If Ironton does not adhere to the same age standard, then there could be a difference in the level of play that each team brings into the game. This does not, however, mean that Ironton should be labeled “Cheaters.” It would only mean that there is a different set of standards between the two schools.
· Fact #6-Ashland has NEVER, and will NEVER play inappropriate grade level players in a game (i.e. 8th graders playing in 7th grade). If it came down to it, Ashland would forfeit rather than play older players in a game, which is an obvious difference to the philosophy put into practice by Ironton.
· Fact #7- No one has addressed the original post’s concerns about dirty play. Ironton had several blatant late hits that were penalized as well as a penalty for a player cursing an official. The Ashland quarterback was the target for several of these shots. For every penalty that was called, there were many that the referees missed. To me, that reflects poorly on Ironton’s coach. Ironton’s 8th grade team is extremely talented and well coached as far as X’s and O’s are concerned, but their coach should be ashamed for allowing that type of play. It only made an excellent team look bad.

I believe that all concerned parties should look at these facts before making an irrational, emotional judgment on Ironton’s 8th grade team. If in fact these players are all “age appropriate” 8th graders, then they should be applauded as one of the best 8th grade teams to come through the Tri-State area in a long time and nothing should be said that would take away from or tarnish their achievements. If the players are not in fact “age appropriate” and enrolled in the 8th grade, then Ironton should seek to reconcile with the teams that they have played against this season. I apologize for the length of this post, but I feel strongly that this post needed to be made.

[sportyfan]

oK am I allowed to agree with squint????


FACT: Jackson played in IRONTON, therefore NO BUS needed!

FACT: Ironton DID play 8th graders against Jackson 7th graders (because they called and said they did nothave enough to make a 7th grae team!). They than changed jerseys on the sidelines for all to see, so that they could than play the 8th grade game. SO HOW can you consider the 7TH GRADE UNDEFEATED?????? The 8th graders have helped win in the Jackson 7th grade game and also Ashland's 7TH Grade game?? How many other games have they let 8th graders play down??? Let them play on their own and see if they remain undefeated!

And as I said Jackson will take their spankings and learn from them but what about the spankings they got for no reason??
All said
FACT: IRonton has enough 7th graders on their roster without playing 8th graders!

The only way an 8th grader should have EVER been put in one of the 7th grade games is
1. There has been prior approval with the AD from the school being played.
2. There is not enough 7th graders to put on the field. No 7th grader should have to stand on the sidelines during their game and watch an 8th grader fill the spot.

[Frank Reagan]

Fact #3- Ironton’s team was much bigger and much more mature looking than the boys on Ashland’s team. In last year’s game, there was not as great of a size discrepancy. Once again, this proves nothing but could explain some of the suspicions that these boys were not of the same age level.

Suspicions? Isn't this age group where a lot of growth spurts take place? This would account for the size discrepancy. But with Ironton it is always suspicions.

Fact #4- Due to the fact that Ironton played 8th graders in the 7th grade game (see Fact #1), it is completely plausible that 9th graders could have been used in the 8th grade game.

No it is not plausible for 9th graders to play in an 8th grade game. OHSAA rules forbid such a practice. 7th and 8th graders, however are allowed to play against each other. Splitting 7th and 8th grade teams is a convenience. It is also a convenience that not all can afford with numbers problems. Sometimes, having 8th graders dress for 7th grade games is done for subbing reasons. Many places I know of have 7th graders dress for 8th grade games. When I played it was just junior high, 7th and 8th always together. Again, like I've said, it is just a matter of convenience to have two games. Plus, Ironton contacted Jackson prior to the game about it and there wasn't any objection, was there?

Fact #5-Ashland has a rule that if an 8th grade player is age 15 by the start of school, he must play up to 9th grade and is not allowed to participate in 8th grade football. All of Ashland’s players are 14 or under. If Ironton does not adhere to the same age standard, then there could be a difference in the level of play that each team brings into the game. This does not, however, mean that Ironton should be labeled “Cheaters.” It would only mean that there is a different set of standards between the two schools.

The OHSAA does have rules governing age when it comes to junior high players playing in their games. Ironton does abide by this rule.

Fact #6-Ashland has NEVER, and will NEVER play inappropriate grade level players in a game (i.e. 8th graders playing in 7th grade). If it came down to it, Ashland would forfeit rather than play older players in a game, which is an obvious difference to the philosophy put into practice by Ironton.

The practice of having 8th graders dress for a 7th grade game is nothing new. Teams with a limited number of 7th graders have used the 8th graders who never get to play as fillers for the team. The 7th grade games is to get PT for everyone who normally wouldn't get to play. If a team has a limited number of 7th graders, what is wrong with adding to the numbers to get the kids a game instead of killing grass during the 8th grade game, especially if the opponent is notified and doesn't have an objection? It is about kids getting time on the field and not sitting around. As for the rather forfeit comment, get a grip. OHSAA and KHSAA rules dictate that unless a game is started, there is no forfeit, just no game is played. Those forfeit rules went out with little league.

[BlindWhiteHat]

Sportyfan continues to say it doesn't matter and he's moved on yet he continues to whine about this loss and accuse a team of wrongdoing.

I don't know the figures but I'll agree with a post of yours that said Ironton has 15 7th graders. Do you really think that playing with 15 players is a good idea? Do you really think that is safe for the players? I realize you need 11 on the field at a time. That changes to 12 if you send offensive plays in by messenger. That leaves 3 players as subs. That is of course if all players are there and healthy. I'm sure if a game was scheduled and your team drove an hour down Rt 93 you wouldn't mind if a game was cancelled at the last minute because a kid didn't show up while another player or two was injured or sick. Common sense tells anyone who knows football that you can't sustain a season with 15 players. That is just nuts.

I'll ask another question about this situation sportyfan is so interested in. Since you watched the players change uniforms (kinda creepy if you ask me) how much did those players play in the 8th grade game? I should rephrase that to say how much did they play before Ironton made it a blowout and emptied the bench. Also, how much playing time did all the 7th graders get? Did any player sit on the bench the entire game or did all get to play a reasonable amount of time?

This is all just sour grapes if you ask me. Ironton called Jackson to clear it before the game and when Jackson loses, there is one parent who can't stand it and makes a big stink over it as well as making other unsubstantiated claims. How sad.

[itownpaw]

I was the one that typed up the roster that was given to me in the summer. Were all those boys on the sidelines? NO. We had some change schools etc. The programs were already made and it was to late to change the roster.

[7989gotscrewed9909]

Sportyfan, you are only halfway right! Ironton did have players playing in the 8th grade game that were too old. Except they werent 9th graders. THEY WERE IRONTON ALUMNI! See, I saw Roman Fry and Tank Whaley changing out of their regular clothes and putting on Ironton uniforms. I said "TANK!" "ROMAN!" "What are you doing?" Each looked up with a sly grin and said "playin some football" Now being an Irontononian myself I decided to keep quiet but then it got worse. I looked over to another car and saw Jermon Jackson and Wolfgang Kratzenberg, again changing out of their regular clothes into Ironton uniforms. Once again I started to ask them just what in the world they were doing but before I could ask they said with a sly grin "save it, we're just playin some football." Now I have to remain anonymous for safety reasons because after all I still have to live here in Ironton but I can no longer condone that type of cheating! It cheats the towns! It cheats the kids! This isnt just a "junior high football game." Its football!!!!

[sportyfan]

I will set one last thing straight!!! There was nothing creepy about watcing these boys change out of their jerseys......they were standing on the sidelines changing in front of God and everyone.

[7989gotscrewed9909]

Sportyfan I too have to set one last thing straight. I kept this taboo last night for fear of retaliation from Ironton fans and also the NCAA! I have to get this off my chest because I havent slept a decent night since what I'm about to reveal has been on my conscience. Yes, as I said earlier Whaley, Fry, Jackson and Kratzenberg all played in that 8th grade junior high game. I did not tell the entire truth because I left one player out. The best guess I have is Tank Whaley must have made a call to Columbus. Not only was he with Fry but he was also with a Mr. Beanie Wells. Now, I was about to ask him "Just what are you doing Mr. Wells? Dont you have bigger fish to fry then some Junior High football game?" Because at the end of the day it is all about the kids! It is in no way about me or any parents trying to relive something through the kids. I swear! It really is all about the kids! Anyhow, Wells would not answer me but I know all four Ironton alumni played plus Beanie Wells! Now I know the classy fans from Jackson will "take a whoopin and learn from it" but this has gone too far! Enough is Enough! We need to start playing fair football because after all its not about me. Its not about Sportyfan! Its not about any relatives of players! Its not about insane accusations! Its about the kids and thats all that matters!