Texas Judge savagely beats 16 year old daughter

[farmer]

Starbase: To justify being leather strap whipped in todays culture you have to rethink that. If you say a child as in 16 year old or more who goes out only to hurt/cause severe trouble,"And they know better", yes I can see using the strap. Just as well as using a leather strap on some adults. That would be on cases of proven rape,abuse,murder or even people like Bernie Madol who stole peoples money to live way above his means. Some of this go to jail for some is a reward.

As the video that is brought out like this just would like to see more if it was a setup or not. Even if it was a setup he still went to far. Also what kind of trouble was she in before and what measures of punishment were used. Some kids think they can do whatever they want and just like a video game hit reset like nothing happened. Somethings you can not do that. This case the Judge would probably want to do things differently himself. I do not see where he should be a judge of people who do wrong. Just like the case of the ex Ironton Police officer who knowingly lied and wrote a ticket to a person who was not even there for the incident she witnessed. They said her credibility would be brought into question for every ticket she would write after that point.

As for corporal punishment being taking out of school. Just as I said earlier you do not give the punishment while you are enraged or upset. You need a cooling off period first. Some teachers would be to upset and not realize how hard they would hit someone or even have good aim.

[starbase_318]

It has been my experience; children who lash out do so because of underlying issues. Many of these behaviors are learned and they are being taught at home by adults. If we as parents and adults aren't trying to figure out WHY our children are acting unruly, prior to a beat down, then we have failed!!

Who knows what drove this beating but I can't imagine a time when I would ever hit my daughter or son in such a fashion.

[farmer]

Starbase you are right. But when you said you could not imagine ever hitting your daughter. That is right but them maybe your daughter didn't do somwe of the things this girls has done. I am not saying you should hit a child but there are some kids who do things wrong no matter how good the parents and home situation is. Some kids never had to earn anything and always are given things by others. Then they do not listen to what the parents say.

I am saying there are loop holes out there that people do not come to mind. There maybe other factors as mental problems that the parents just do not see or understand how to deal with. Which the parents think they are being manipulated. Or even in severe cases the child threatens to even kill their parents. Just a more open mind to what maybe out there in some severe cases.

[starbase_318]

I really do understand your point, farmer. All I'm saying, I just can't see myself ever doing it. Now, that doesn't mean I can't go off my rocker and lash out in a fit of rage. It just means in my calm state I can't think of a time when I would take a belt to her for something she had done as a teen.

[toast]

It's hard to believe in this day and age some people still believe a child must be hit when they misbehave in order to instill discipline. Nothing could be further from the truth!

There are excellent discipline programs that don't ever use hitting as a consequence for misdeeds. They work fine. Not only do they work, numerous studies have confirmed the children end up with fewer problems later in life than those who have been hit.

[KVDW]

have you ever hit somebody or some thing with a doubled up belt? it pops like a shotgun with the slightest stroke making it sound a lot worse than it really is.
in fact, you don't even have to hit anything with it. simply grab each end of a doubled belt and push it towards the center (causing a gap between the layers) and then jerk it suddenly outward..... it will pop like a shotgun.
i don't think she was "hurt" nearly as badly as it might appear.

as we have heard a lot in the news in the last couple of years, in some cultures it is completely OK to KILL children that disobey. im certainly not saying that that is OK, but merely that this incident is pretty mild comparably speaking. ie, put things into perspective.

the problem i have observed in corporal punishment is that parents wait til the kids are 14-15 years old before they do it (after all the time-outs etc. over the years hasn't worked) and it's waaaay too late by then. i think it needs to start when they are like 2 years old (and no, toast, i'm not saying hit your 2 year old with a ballbat), but something like a paint stir paddle made of balsa wood or the like lightly administered to the back of the legs works wonders.

history has shown that people like abuck and toast will jump on this saying i'm advocating "beating" 2 year olds but they know that is not the case at all, but go ahead and have at it boys.

[KVDW]

This is not the 50s and times have changed. WHat was once the norm has become abuse in many areas of our country.

this is very true ...... and this country has gradually gone to shiit over the last 40 years because of it.

i guarantee you that the folks of what is considered "the greatest generation" got their little butts whipped when needed..... as compared to this "out of control generation" that has had to suffer endless time-out, etc.

[Tigercannon71]

This is not the 50s and times have changed. WHat was once the norm has become abuse in many areas of our country.

this is very true ...... and this country has gradually gone to shiit over the last 40 years because of it.

i guarantee you that the folks of what is considered "the greatest generation" got their little butts whipped when needed..... as compared to this "out of control generation" that has had to suffer endless time-out, etc.

Exactly!!! Great Post!!

[toast]

What's sad is that most parents don't begin to understand discipline and what it entails. I'll bet many parents think consequences and discipline are one in the same. Anyone who has taken classes on discipline knows better. It's complex and requires hard work and lot's of knowledge and many proactive steps.

Blaming societal problems on the lack of spanking is ludicrous. Spanking is part of the problem!


The evidence against spanking is overwhelming. Hundreds of studies all come to the same conclusions:

1. The more physical punishment a child receives, the more aggressive he or she will become.
2. The more children are spanked, the more likely they will be abusive toward their own children.
3. Spanking plants seeds for later violent behavior.
4. Spanking doesn't work.

The evidence is overwhelming. I would encourage all parents to seek better alternatives.

[starbase_318]

I have now been convinced...I'm a converted man....Let's take them out back and horse whip them when they act inappropriately or when they don't measure up in our eyes.....Let's also allow out of control educator's take a 3 inch thick, 5 inch wide taped board with 1/2 inch holes drilled into it to bust their little patoots when they look at us cross eyed.

[KVDW]

What's sad is that most parents don't begin to understand discipline and what it entails. I'll bet many parents think consequences and discipline are one in the same. Anyone who has taken classes on discipline knows better. It's complex and requires hard work and lot's of knowledge and many proactive steps.

Blaming societal problems on the lack of spanking is ludicrous. Spanking is part of the problem!


The evidence against spanking is overwhelming. Hundreds of studies all come to the same conclusions:

1. The more physical punishment a child receives, the more aggressive he or she will become.
2. The more children are spanked, the more likely they will be abusive toward their own children.
3. Spanking plants seeds for later violent behavior.
4. Spanking doesn't work.

The evidence is overwhelming. I would encourage all parents to seek better alternatives.

i think some of us have had TOO MANY "classes" from "experts".

why won't they admit that discipline and respect (from children) have decidedly declined following their guidelines ?

[wildthingRV]

It's funny, but I deal with HS kids every day. I have their respect, and I've never laid a hand on a kid for misbehavior. In fact, I find our student body, for the most part, to be respectful to all the teachers and staff, and we don't beat them. Ever.

The few that are disrespectful wouldn't be magically respectful if we beat them. They would possibly be afraid, but that's not even the same thing.

[farmer]

Wildthing that is kind of funny coming from someone who's location is the california penal league. Just joking

It is good you never had to lay a hand on a kid for misbehaving. Your situation at your school seems to be good. Not all students everywhere listen to the staff or stop their misbehaving. Where staff may have to step in to protect other students or themselves.

[wildthingRV]

That IS funny. The Cali Penal League thing is a Rick Vaughn joke.

In the interest of full disclosure, I did have a kid swing at me once. His biggest mistake was that he missed me and hit a total lunatic of a kid, who hit him back, and it was that cliche two hit fight. Kid A hits Kid B. Kid B hits the floor. Isolated incident, and Kid B (who did the swinging to begin with) suffered from some serious mental problems which were hithero undiagnosed, but caused rage issues. The kid who hit him back was thrown out of the Marine Corp for being in too many fights.

That was the perfect storm of weird, but that was years ago. Spanking wouldn't have help either, I don't think.

[KVDW]

The few that are disrespectful wouldn't be magically respectful if we beat them.

why must you always equate a sensible, humane switching or paddling of a child with a "beating" ? is it just a "thing" with you or are you just always trying to strengthen your position by overkill ?

[KVDW]

It's funny, but I deal with HS kids every day. I have their respect, and I've never laid a hand on a kid for misbehavior. In fact, I find our student body, for the most part, to be respectful to all the teachers and staff, and we don't beat them. Ever.

The few that are disrespectful wouldn't be magically respectful if we beat them. They would possibly be afraid, but that's not even the same thing.

i remember a couple of teachers like you. they were the ones the kids laughed and giggled about when their backs were turned.

[toast]

The few that are disrespectful wouldn't be magically respectful if we beat them.

why must you always equate a sensible, humane switching or paddling of a child with a "beating" ? is it just a "thing" with you or are you just always trying to strengthen your position by overkill ?

There is no such thing as a sensible, humane switching or paddling. Neither make sense when there are more appropriate alternatives.

[Tigercannon71]

What do you mean there is no such thing as a sensible or humane paddling? What do you think the punishment should be sitting down and talking it out while singing kumbya? We arent talking about a paddling on first offense its after all other avenues of punishment have failed. I know the switch was my grandmas last resort. She gave you chances to act right, but if you continued you got the switch.

[wildthingRV]

It's funny, but I deal with HS kids every day. I have their respect, and I've never laid a hand on a kid for misbehavior. In fact, I find our student body, for the most part, to be respectful to all the teachers and staff, and we don't beat them. Ever.

The few that are disrespectful wouldn't be magically respectful if we beat them. They would possibly be afraid, but that's not even the same thing.

i remember a couple of teachers like you. they were the ones the kids laughed and giggled about when their backs were turned.

Given that you don't know me from a bag of rocks, that means positively nothing. Fact is that I get what I need when I need it, I treat kids with basic dignity and have next to no discipline issues. In my experience, the kids don't wait to disrespect a teacher until his back his turned. If they think you are soft, they push to your face. That doesn't happen to me. Not saying it never did, but but not too much anymore.

[wildthingRV]

What do you mean there is no such thing as a sensible or humane paddling? What do you think the punishment should be sitting down and talking it out while singing kumbya? We arent talking about a paddling on first offense its after all other avenues of punishment have failed. I know the switch was my grandmas last resort. She gave you chances to act right, but if you continued you got the switch.

Paddling isn't an option where I work, so I find other ways, and it works just fine.

I have kids, and I've spanked my kids (well, kid. I haven't spanked my 15 month old because I don't know that it would make a lick of sense to her).

Why are the only two options spanking and hand-holding. You need to get more creative.

Anything involving a weapon (paddle, belt, tire iron) is beyond what I will do.