Division IV Southeast District Tournament teams/records

[socsportsfan1]

No, they haven't had majority but they have worked together in some years. I think in 02-03 they schemed together quite well with help from Western (who voted pro SHL since they still had more ties to the SHL, it was Western's first year in the SOC). So, yeah, I think so. You think the SHL coaches don't scheme just as much??? The best teams, the deserving teams, will come out a pretty high percentage of the time. Is that not the risk you take when you schedule up, and to be "battle tested"? I would bet my money that if the SHL schools would schedule a few of the SOC schools and beat them and come in with 11-6 records, or 10-5, etc. that would be more convincing and deserving of them getting higher seeds (at least in the SOC coaches minds). Playing close to bigger teams just doesn't always cut it, especially when at the draw you only write you win-loss on the board. New Boston, Notre Dame, Western, etc. can go to Hillsboro or Court House and lose too.

If you guys want to argue about collusion, schedule and beat the teams in your sectional, then if you don't get a "deserving" seed you can cry foul.

[Ironman92]

Scheduling those teams is the thing to do to get you ready for the tourney to better help you beat the teams as good or slightly better than you.....but Whiteoak and Fairfield get ripped for those better schedules for they are out numbered greatly during the seedings. Why isn't strength of schedule considered? Why would you just write your records on the board...how is that fair?

Funny thing about 2002 and 2003......Whiteoak went to the Final 4 in 2002 and beat Green in the district semis by 20 and rolled on through to the final 4...the very next year losing 4 of their 5 starters were the last team standing in D4 again and making it to the Elite 8...are you saying that team was assisted by the SHL coaches in the sectional seedings? lol

During Cam Thoroughman's sr year at Clay he (I forget why) was out for about 1/2 of the season and were like 10-10....but were a "hot" team with Thoroughman back and Western and South Webster got the around playing them and guess who had to play the healthy team that lost in the district finals the year before and had WVU signee back for his sr year....Whiteoak did....and destroyed them by about 20 points.

Thanks for the reminder of 2002-2003, you had to go back 7-8 years to find an example and it sounds pretty weak since WO made the final 4 and elite 8.

I'm done talking about this..it's over. The important thing is the kids playing. The kids didn't decide the seedings.....they are just going to play. Best of luck to any team that plays hard with good sportsmanship! SOC, SHL or SVC...doesn't matter. Hopefully a couple of teams from this sectional can make a nice run and one of them get to the regionals.

[MTSWNGRVSG]

The team that is playing the best at tournament time will come out no matter where they are on the bracket! You will NEVER be able to take the human effect out of the process. Is it perfect-but then again what is?

[The Ghost of Swanker]

No reason to argue about it, we all know who's comin out on top

all jokes aside, yes the seeding of this sectional is BS

[BasketballFan1]

Does anyone know exactly how the voting went? Everyone is speculating how it went, but does anyone know for sure? Everyone can say what they want but if they do not know exactly what went on it that room at the Draw then all the speculation if for nothing. I would like to see some facts on who actually voted for who before an opinion is reached on my part!

[socsportsfan1]

Ironman,

I was referring to more than one team, not just Whiteoak. You think other SHL teams didn't benefit? Thanks for the stroll down memory lane though. Oh, if you haven't heard...life's not fair.

For those of you who think the district board would be better suited to administer over this more directly, take a look at the D-III Jackson sectional. That makes the problems with seeding at the sectional level look very miniscule.

[sparky]

socsportsfan,
i believe whiteoak got all of the first place votes in 03, so i am not sure what you are talking about.

[Ironman92]

Life's not fair.

Man I wish sparky would unveil all he knew about this topic.

[Ironman92]

3 can never outnumber 6.....I just don't see what you are getting at. If all 3 SHL coaches voted the exact same way.....it would mean little to how the actual totals came out.

Life isn't fair......theat pretty much explains it.

How many times in the past 12 years has an SOC small school made it to regionals? How many times have they won a single game at the district level? Anyone other than Western Pike from the SOC make the regionals in this past decade...I know Clay won a game Cam's jr year at district....I think East won a game at district in the mid 2000's...what others are there?

[superman06]

[quote="futurebkstar"]so do you think st joe is playing better ball right now?? This matchup happens soon. South gallia has won 6 of the last 8 losing to #3 southern and #1 oak hill[/quote]


Well, who has South Gallia beaten in those six?

[Snowman]

i'm afraid you have to include south websters and oak hills success

the soc has two divisions unlike the shl so you cant just say soc i. you have to include all soc teams in div. 4 over the years not just the smaller division. i know of several teams that would like to have south webster in soc i (it would make the whole division better)

[Ironman92]

The SHL absolutely has 2 divisions. And everyone plays everyone at least once....1/2 of the bigger school play each small school 2 times I believe.

Why would you include Oak Hill....they don't even play the smaller schools. Yes they were D4 for 2 years.....but they don't play those SOC small schools. The SHL everyone plays everyone at least once....many of the small school SHL teams play the bigger ones twice...some just once....depends on the year. South Webster is not in that division of the SOC in basketball. North Adams has been D4 in basketball but they are in the bigger school of the SHL....Peebles is in the small school but I'm not including them even though they are 17-0....at least we all face each other.

[sparky]

ironman,
don't forget that western was in the shl for a while. i believe the main reason they went to the soc was to be able to compete for league championships. i don't know how long they were in the shl but i don't remember them ever being in the running for a league championship. the year they made the regional they definitely would have been in contention.
on another note, the last 3 or 4 years western had some very good players, are any of them still playing somewhere?

[Snowman]

ironman92, youre right about the divisions but they are forced to play each other. the soc is not so it isnt a true separation of divisions. clay is the only one who typically plays many of the div ii teams. this year they will play south webster twice, minford, valley, northwest. in the past they have also had west and wheelersburg on the schedule.

if the smaller schools didnt have to play the larger schools by league rule in the shl--would they? at least on a regular basis. i know rivalries and gate$ would be part of it but it would help them schedule other non-league games. a old coach of mine once said he wanted to play those teams he would face in the tournament. other coaches have other ideas when it comes to seeing a tournament opponent more than once.

do those games count in league standings? if so, i wouldnt want to play them unless i had home and away scheduled for league consideration

[kramer]

ironman92, youre right about the divisions but they are forced to play each other. the soc is not so it isnt a true separation of divisions. clay is the only one who typically plays many of the div ii teams. this year they will play south webster twice, minford, valley, northwest. in the past they have also had west and wheelersburg on the schedule.

if the smaller schools didnt have to play the larger schools by league rule in the shl--would they? at least on a regular basis. i know rivalries and gate$ would be part of it but it would help them schedule other non-league games. a old coach of mine once said he wanted to play those teams he would face in the tournament. other coaches have other ideas when it comes to seeing a tournament opponent more than once.

do those games count in league standings? if so, i wouldnt want to play them unless i had home and away scheduled for league consideration

There are 10 teams in the SHL. Each division has 5 teams. Small division plays every small division team twice and plays every big division once for a total of 13 league games. There are two SHL champions because the small and large division have different schedules although everyone plays everyone atleast once in the league. Some small divison/large division school chose to play each other twice but only one of the games count toward the league.

[Ironman92]

^^^^complete answer

thanks for the info on Clay.....that's good for them

[BasketballFan1]

snowman just an fyi...Western plays two of the SOC 2 schools in d3 Lucasville Valley and d2 Waverly. Granted that isnt as many SOC 2 schools as Clay but they do play two of them as well as the rest of there non-conference schedule from this season that included d3 Southeastern, d3 Paint Valley, and d4 Manchester. They also played d4 Eastern Pike as a non-conference game this year as they met up with them in the Holiday Classic.

I really like the idea of some of the schools in this sectional playing each other during the regular season to end some of these debates. Year in and Year out I believe the SHL is much stronger than most SOC 1 schools, even this year. Now in some recent years there have been some SOC 1 schools that could have done more than hold their own vs the SHL.

The easiest way to compare right now is by looking at common teams played. Currently that is really the only way to settle the debate.

Other than the SOC schools against each other and the SHL schools against each other, has anyone in this sectional already played against each other. I know Manchester beat Western early in the season. Any other games?

[a_c_m]

The tournament begins next week........

2/22
at Valley High School

#8 seed Latham Western 4-13 vs. #9 seed New Boston Glenwood 4-12 (6:15)

#7 seed Sciotoville East 4-11 vs. #10 seed Portsmouth Notre Dame 4-12 (8:00)

These are all SOC I schools playing against each other. I don't see any complaints from anyone on these games.


at Wellston

#8 seed Ironton St.Joseph 4-11 vs. #9 seed Hemlock Miller 1-16 (7:00)

Records are as of the drawing date.

[a_c_m]

2/23

at Valley

#4 seed Mowrystown Whiteoak 9-8 vs. #5 seed Leesburg Fairfield 9-8 (6:15)

#3 seed Manchester 10-8 vs. #6 seed Portsmouth Clay 7-10 (8:00)


at Wellston

#2 seed Beaver Eastern 14-2 vs. #7 seed Waterford 4-11 (6:15)

#3 seed Racine Southern 12-4 vs. #6 seed Mercerville South Gallia 7-9 (8:00)

Records are as of drawing date.

[oldpgguy]

so do you think st joe is playing better ball right now?? This matchup happens soon. South gallia has won 6 of the last 8 losing to #3 southern and #1 oak hill

Well, who has South Gallia beaten in those six?

Hannan (WV) twice
Ohio Valley Christian
Teays Valley Christian
New Boston
Cross Lanes Christian